Why Buy the Cow?
Ron Bolin: Mar.18, 2011
Last Monday Council directed the Economic Development Commission to “proceed with the establishment of an Economic Development Corporation within the constraints of existing City funding levels and appoint the existing Commission members as the interim board of directors.” The vote passed 7 to 1. The funding thereby approved was $1,357,000, considerably higher than the $350,000 we started with in 2005.
Next Monday, March 21, Council will deal with a recommendation to hire a consultant to find a leader of the Economic Development Corporation, thus proceeding quickly down a very hastily and ill-defined path of expenditures for which the taxpayers of Nanaimo will be liable.
In speaking with City Hall about this matter, I suggested a truly private mode for its operation whereby primary funding came from those sources mentioned in the Staff Report to Council, i.e. $400,000 raised from a 2% local hotel tax; the $70,000 in memberships referenced; and tying down some of the other sources of contract income noted in the report to Council. I further suggested a substantial sum similar in proportion to that provided by the hotel tax from other city businesses. In this case the city could provide some additional initial funding, perhaps over a three year period to assist in the establishment of the Corporation while its success is measured.
I was informed that such a model was discussed with business but was rejected. On reflection their reasoning is clear: Why buy the cow when the milk is free?
If taxpayers pay the total freight how can the corporation be arm’s length? The issue of Economic Development is an important one. The corporate structure as presented is simply a case of moving around the deck chairs on the Titanic. The concept is worthy of more discussion but cannot be successful without the tangible buy-in of our local businesses, and that buy-in will not take place without independence from City Hall.
I was informed that the reason that business did not feel that they should make any extraordinary contribution to this venture is that they currently pay nearly 3 times the mil rate charged to residential property. I would venture that this is an exceedingly short sited view of the situation. Where is the information which shows the costs of the infrastructure which serves residents relative to those servicing commercial establishments? My questions in this regard have been met as if the relation of costs to benefits were an idea which had never been considered –and perhaps it hasn’t.
I would propose that one measure of the relative costs of servicing these different elements of a community might be to examine the start and ends of trips made between them. I would submit, first that the number of trips to and from a residence every day/month/year is a very small proportion of those made to and from commercial establishments, or those establishments would be out of business and that they are therefore rightly charged at a higher mil rate to cover those increased costs.
Second, as we in Nanaimo are dealing primarily with relatively small commercial operations rather than giant industrial organizations which create their own magnet, the reason businesses operate in Nanaimo is because of the residents. It is not the case that residents come to Nanaimo because of the businesses located her.
It is unreasonable for the Nanaimo Business Community to expect taxpayers to directly bear the entire burden of Economic Development in the city rather than the relatively small proportion by which we all directly benefit from it. Most of the income in town is generated by government or quasi government agencies rather than business. The proportion of total Nanaimo property taxes paid by residents far exceeds those paid by the commercial and industrial sectors combined. There was a day when our large shopping centres and big box stores acted as magnets to attract business from some distance. As other malls and big box stores came to surrounding communities, our magnets have lost much of their power.
Will the new magnets which the city seeks be created by our City Council or Staff. I doubt it –and so apparently does business. Let’s get this thing right before we find ourselves, as so often, in the losers seat again.
Posts and Comments on Nanaimo Governance 
I agree taxpayers should not be on the hook for economic development, Ron, but your suggestion to use a hotel tax to pay for it has one small problem: In order for it it fly, it requires the support of a majority of hoteliers, including the majority of hotel rooms. Which means it needs the support of the Coast Bastion. The Coast has never supported this tax. Unless you know something new, my guess is the Coast has not changed its position, therefor, the hotel tax is a dead issue. Until another hotel comes along, at least as large as the Coast Bastion, and whose operators support such a tax. It can not be imposed on the industry by an outside agency, such as the city.
A lot of businesses would be hard pressed to identify the triple benefits that they derive from triple taxes. I certainly can’t identify those big benefits I receive in my own case. The ground floor of the building where my office is located is zoned commercial and, of course, the taxes are three times those of the residential units above me (Hello Frank). What are the extra benefits – there are none. Not that the residential units are particularly benefited either. Because it is a strata building the garbage is not even picked up by the City. There is a road out front which has been a mess for the past year because of construction (not complaining, glad to see the station restored). Add insult to injury there is an extra $500.00 that has to be paid to the DBIA to cover whatever they do nowadays.
Commercial tenants always end up paying for those triple property taxes by way of additional rent and in more than a few cases they pay almost as much for the property tax portion as their base rent. There is one reality for Woodgrove; there is a far different reality for the small business scattered along Bowen Road or Commercial Street or the Old Island Highway. There aren’t swarms of people wearing out the roads and sidewalks to access their businesses. Many of these businesses are hanging in there only because their owners work long hours for below minimum wage remuneration.
There are also expensive services which basically are there for people in their capacity as residents, eg. Parks and Recreation. I think if a genuine benefit audit was done many owners or renters of commercially taxed properties would rank at the low end. But – to utilize Ron’s analogy – many people in this government dependent community have always seen business as a kind of cash cow that can be milked endlessly.
Certainly legitimate questions can be asked about the Economic Development Corporation starting with the most basic one: What is its purpose? Is its purpose primarily to support tourism? Tourism brings different benefits to different businesses. The hotel industry would obviously like a few more tourists to help push up their anemic occupancy rates. Tourists also fill up some seats in downtown bars and restaurants during the summer months. For many businesses, however, tourism does not have much effect on their bottom line other than the general effect of overall enhanced economic activity in the community (the local cheerleaders for tourism would have you believe that it is the linchpin of the local economy).
What if any benefit will the dollars spent on tourism have on the average person that lives in the Harewood or Dover Bay areas?
As for the Coast Hotel. It seems impervious to what the City demands of the populous!I neither asks for nor gives.(correct me if I am wrong)Oddly the Coast Bastion is owned by the Operating Engineers Union that one would think pay Union wages & benefits.
That said ; they survive in a market where a competitive hotel is yet to be built..
Strange days indeed..
I was led to believe that an agreement with the hotel association was close at hand but that the problem lay in the rest of the business community. What is the proportion of rooms held by the Coast Bastion that they can stifle this action (assuming that the others are willing)?
David Brown makes a significant argument about why some segments of the business community might not want to add to their current burden just to get more development in town and raises some compelling questions about money spent on activities which primarily affect residents. To my mind this simply reinforces the need for an independent core review which Council has so cavalierly dismissed. We need to bring our wants into balance with our ability to pay, but not, according to this Council, this year.
The very serious question regarding the purpose of the EDCorp has only been answered with fluff and the assertion of the “success” of the model in other communities. Without a clear focus and with a corporate structure which is neither led by entrepreneurs nor funded by those willing to take personal risks, I believe this Corporation is dead on arrival despite its good intentions.
I don’t believe the intent of the new Corporation is to focus solely on Tourism, but rather develop an overall strategy that will attract new business of all flavours, as well as encourage others to move to our Island Paradise in the Pacific.
As for the benefit to different communities in the city? Ideally, a vibrant, healthy, growing business sector is supposed to be good for the community as a whole, and will benefit all as providing the tax base for all the infrastructure we aren’t presently funding.
Cheers
Jim Taylor
http://www.NanaimoBlog.com
Jim:
I agree about the intent, but the problem arises in that we are even discussing this. It should be clear. And if it is not, we shouldn’t be handing over $1.4 million.
Jim: If I am not mistaken, a strategy, sometimes known as a business plan, is developed before the business is started, and for sure before it can get money from any outsiders. Why we persist in ignoring this principle is beyond me.
What infrastructure are we not currently funding (as either a current or future debit) and how do we fund it better by adding more?
Ron: I think the whole idea is to leave the business plan, strategy, development and execution of same, to the yet to be hired head of this new corporation, period. The Economic Development Committee has been chasing this around for over a year, and we are where we are now.
As to council oversight, logic etc., I have long since quit hurting my puzzler with trying to puzzle out, why they do what they do.
As to unfunded infrastructure, I refer to the report which would show a nearly $13 million shortfall in funds being allocated to maintain water, roads and sewer at historic levels of cost.
An issue which only Murray McNab makes reference during the hotly contested by-election debates.
I understand about the lurking infrastructure maintenance costs, but how do we mitigate those costs by adding new infrastructure?
Economic Council mark II.
We have had an economic council for over a decade: still we have hotels with “tepid occupancy”.
There seems to be a blind faith in tourism yet the city has very little to attract tourists.
International tourism is in decline. World finance is at a tipping point: has no one noticed?
An eyesore of a cruise ship pier is looming adding to an already unattractive waterfront supposedly to bring a bonanza of wealth from debarking passengers.
A previous post already pointed out that fallacy: passengers debark after being sated by all the shipboard amenities anyone would want. Few may come ashore to spend: most take buses to Cathedral Grove and Chemainus murals sitting quietly in their air conditioned seats enjoying the passing view.
Real estate speculation has kept us hypnotized by numbers. Expecting our wealth to grow thru title inflation is yesterdays lost dream: it never was reality! The delusion of sprawl and “go-shopping” has been dragging the economy down for decades: every one thought it was white bread.
We are told the island is deficient in food sources: Seaspan ferries trucks loaded with necessities every day: from as far away as San Joaquin. Our obsession with sprawl has made land barren that other wise could be economically very productive: especially with attendant job creating processing plants. Instead we give tax breaks to Harmac with a life span clearly limited.
25% of households depend on some level of government supported. Government is the only viable means of employment: most youngsters work as baristas or caddies, or leaving town: up and comers have nowhere to go.
Officially, there is a determined refusal to address alternatives.
Governance is encumbered by a decrepit council lumbered with an antediluvian, overloaded bureaucracy that no one dares question: least of all a disengaged public who must struggle with inertia and ineptness daily.
Editors of this blog are only too trigger happy to block posts, or indeed, posters who do not tow the line. Local MSM is feeble: healthy debate just does not exist in Nanaimo.
This blog seems to be the domain of about half a dozen disgruntled people blind to the symptoms of a stagnant economy who either lack vision, or refuse to address Nanaimo’s chronic dysfunction.
Insight of this nature is met with stunned silence.
More than anything this blog, this city is profoundly lacking in new blood, courage and imagination.
The city need more than ECII to get beyond myopia . . .
Now that you have clearly listed all the problems, Roger…
What is the solution ???????
Like the alcoholic; until you admit to the failing you are not likely to change.With stagflation looming upon the horizon we,in Nanaimo, have yet to admit there is a problem.
The MSM (particularly the local newspapers) constantly bombard us with feel good stories of a rejuvenation of the forest industry (false) good employment figures(false) promises of economic salvation from tax payer funded projects( very false) the list goes on.
A fly on the wall tells me that Mayor Ruttan, Councillors Holdom,Unger & Bestwick consider it their jobs to “create wealth”
I can only think they have been successful in disposing of taxpayers wealth these last few years.
As to farming on Vancouver Island.
I think we are missing the point when we only consider farming as fields of crops & cattle & small time producers.
Like it or not fish farming for salmon or shellfish produces not just food but good full time,sustainable, jobs.
We have a small but vibrant egg & poultry industry (again reasonable paying full time jobs)
Even the cattle farmers produce products that are reared slaughtered & taken to market without leaving the Island.
Though subsidised the dairy farmers do well , we have berry farms
& some mid size produce growers.
If ! the forest industry was better regulated I think it fair to consider “tree farming” as a sustainable viable industry with benefits that go far beyond marketable products.
These,sustainable, jobs served us well in bygone; years why not now?
Roger: As I have explained why your comments were not immediately posted, I hope you will have the grace to retract the statement that you are/were being blocked. Please feel free to take any legitimate shots at the blog and/or me as long as you keep it at least semi-civilized.
Perhaps you wouldn’t mind telling us which of the six candidates you feel will best meet the demands that you have put forward, and why.
Small questions. “25% of households depend on some level of government support.” How is this interpreted? How wide is the net cast to yield that percentage? For example, the home owner grant itself is government support, although I wouldn’t interpret “dependent” as being a recipient of the home owner grant. But looking at Nanaimo’s growing over-sixty-five population, all of them, pretty well, would be receiving Old Age Security, and a lot of them would be receiving Canada Pension Plan support as well. How many people have retired from government employment somewhere else and then moved to Nanaimo, bringing their government pension cheques with them? Then there’s the extra income credit for being sixty-five or over. How is “dependent on government support” interpreted?
I don’t know how it translates into depend on government support, but for the month of Feb. the unemployment rate in Nanaimo hit 11%. I presume a large number of those are dependent on UI or welfare.
Also the number of families totally dependent on welfare has always be considerable in Nanaimo.
Of course this ignores ALL the people employed by government, whom I would suggest are totally dependent on government support.
The point I am trying to make is that the old saws, real estate, sprawl, tourism, complaining to a too-long-in-the-tooth council and mirroring bureaucracy are no longer serving the city.
Nanaimo needs a new paradigm.
Food is looming large on the scale of rising commodities.
Nanaimo has an abundance of fallow land that could be made fertile with the right polices and investments.
Farming, food production, processing and marketing provides many fecund opportunities for local investment and employment.
All that is needed are the right people making the right decisions, the right policies and the will and courage to make the change.
Roger K
We all seem quite adept at shooting holes in Nanaimo and it’s pathetic state.
Perhaps if the critics could also point to the Utopian state that we may copy, it would be helpful.
I have just replied Jim . . . are you unable to see . . .
I have just presented a reasonable plan of approach . . . Food etc . . . why are you unable to accept one solution to “Nanaimo and it’s pathetic state.” which by the way is your assessment, not mine?
I may be missing something about hitching our wagon to agriculture. Last I checked farmers in Victoria and on the mainland would have NO crops if they weren’t importing labour.
We don’t actually raise real ‘workers’ anymore, they are all entitled to much loftier pursuits.
Jim, what gets confused in Nanaimo (and other communities) is when it is appropriate for something to be a private enterprise and when it is appropriate to be a state enterprise. Private enterprises in Nanaimo (as represented by the Chamber of Commerce) seem to be keen on the state paying for initiatives which might be of some benefit to them but which they would never in a hundred years take on themselves. If, for example, the hotel industry thought collective advertising was highly likely to be effective they would do it themselves. The Chamber of Commerce itself could perform the functions of the Economic Development Commission (wasn’t that the original notion behind Chambers of Commerce) if it was convinced that it was win-win expenditure of its member’s money. In a more statist economy like China’s government plays a big background role in directing economic development. That is not the case here. The Economic Development Corporation will have no real tools to “cause” new economic development – such as being able to give grants or make low interest loans or make tax concessions or provide cheap land. What will it do? Part of the budget is advertising but do you need a $200,000.00 CEO (and four or five additional employees) to do $250,000.00 worth of advertising? Lobbying? Not likely that it can do effective lobbying from a base in Nanaimo. Information dissemination? Businesses interested in locating in this area will do their own information gathering without leaving their computer screens. A clerk could handle any information requests directed to City Hall.
The local economy will motor on and businesses will come and go – affected by decisions made in Toronto or New York or Peking or events occurring in London, Tokyo or Saudi Arabia – but quite oblivious to the Economic Development Corporation.
David: You have hit on the nub of the problem. While it is natural for all of us to want something for nothing, on the other hand, none of us wants to have our money invested in a firm in which we have no confidence. It is to resolve these issues that I have suggested a privately funded (with perhaps some city input) Economic Development Corporation which is outside the grasp of City Staff or Council, at least until the next time it wants further investment. Somebody’s skin needs to be in the game. As currently set out none of the actors have their own skins at risk.
David; I am not endorsing the new corporation, personally I think it is just another invention to waste more tax dollars, while appearing to be doing something. IMHO, politicians and civil servants don’t seem to think they are functioning unless they are creating ways to spend money.
As for the effectiveness of a $750,000 staff to spend $500,000, simply represents one more folly you can add to the list for this council.
If anyone thinks that a half million ad budget is going to yield any real results, they are demonstrating their ignorance of the field. As for hiring another $200,000 staffer and thinking they really have the ability to develop and execute a REAL economic plan, that is just more pipe dreams. We already have a stable full of those types, and where are we???
I know of several more effective ways of using that half a million so that it really accomplishes something, but have spoken to enough on council to realize I would be just wasting my breath.
I am too long in the tooth to attempt pushing wagons up hill with a rope!
Ron,
Thanqxz for clearing that up: glad to hear it was a digital glitch.
As for economic development. Why do we need an economic commission? Why do we need another level of interference?
Economic decision come out of an organic necessity: no need for an eco-com to start the local mining, fishing or logging industries.
Council could create farm land in one evening and will do so when necessity knocks. In the mean time check out Dirk Becker . . .
http://www.nanaimoinformation.com/forum/showthread.php?6328-Lantzville-shuts-down-Dirk-Becker-s-urban-farm
He has something to tell us.
Too much analysis leads to paralysis!
Creating farmland is one thing, although this area seems to have acres and acres only good for growing rock gardens.
Once the farmland exists, I presume by zoning, and then cultivating and building up the soil you need to find enough people who are farmers at heart (they are a special breed), then from among the generation that has been raised with an air of entitlement you need to find a work force …. good luck with that.
I do see what you are saying, I simply think it a most difficult and likely unproductive expenditure of energy.
I have a lot of admiration for Dirk Becker.
That said he will not save the world.
Had we, in Nanaimo, 500 or better still 1000 Becker’s then we could make a difference to the demands on commercial farming & food supply.
His call has the sound of allotments & Victory gardens!
As to farmland. I think it is somewhat scarce around Nanaimo.
The Comox Valley , Saanich Peninsula & the Cowichan Valley offer the best of farmland on this Island (as ,Yorkshire Lad, does Yorkshire to the UK)
We should not look for a one size fits all saviour our ‘redemption” will come from diversity.
At the moment we are caught in a vortex of expansion,development & build it & they will come! both in Nanaimo & the RDN; old habits die hard..
Just a comment on the suitability of farm land around Nanaimo. I visited Dirk soon after he acquired his present “farm”. The soil had been stripped bare for sale before he bought it. There was no soil to speak of. What he farms today was painstakingly built up over the years from available compostable materials: chips, seaweed, etc. Given the drive and the energy even the most barren of land can be made to produce. His efforts can, with vision and sweat, be copied by those with strength and determination.
I think we can all agree that local governance is lacking, unlike our provincial and federal and global governance.
In the area of economic development which fool proof model employed by these levels of senior government do you think we should adopt. It only took $20 billion or so to keep the car industry afloat and how many trillion to bail out the banking industry?
Here’s a free idea to put Nanaimo on the Map. It would cost several million to employ, but once done would last many years.
Put a HUGE LED Sign on Mt. Benson ( not unlike the famous Hollywood signs) and have it scrolling the message that Nanaimo is the Most Desirable, Livable, Small City in North America, A perfect place to live, work, play and invest.
Make sure the sign is the Biggest of it’s kind and invite Guinness World Book to declare it so. Invite people from all over the world to see this iconic feature, since Nanaimo really is lacking any Iconic attraction ……..
Still think the Geriatric Theme Park has merit.
How long do you suppose it would take council to approve such a sign?
Jim. Along with the huge LED sign we could have a paved four lane freeway going to the peak of Mount Benson. We could then erect a highrise building and have a revolving restaurant at the top. Nanaimo has tried giving new life to bright ideas from the 1970’s. Why not go with a big one from the 1950’s.
With a little bit of blasting there would also be room for your Geriatric Theme Park. But why stop there. Waterslides, carnival rides, miniature golf course, maybe even another Conference Centre. And don’t forget the Nature Centre with a replica Westcoast forest with model cougars and bears (they could be made lifelike – every so often they would bounce out of the forest and pounce on some kid walking down the nature trail). And what about a Recycling Village – a street of houses where everyone is the perfect recycler spending their day sorting their wastes into the 27 different coloured buckets lined up along the curb.
Hey guys: Let’s keep those innovative ideas rolling in. I think we are getting somewhere!!
Roger is 110% correct in noteing Nanaimo has a decrepit Council and equally bad bureaucracy.What is the solution to this?Change Council by electing new members of course.Pretty simple concept,but not as easy to accomplish.When I was involved in the blog in its very early days I was hoping that this was the primary goal of our efforts but,alas,it never worked out that way.Other directions developed and the pure political part never gained traction.To repeat myself,if you want a better city you must get better management,elected and non-elected.
For the sake of argument, let’s say that Wayne and Roger have correctly identified the problem. What do we do about it? Are we into an infinite Alphonse and Gaston routine where we all stand at the door and wait for the other to enter? Who is going to lead the potential parade through the portal -whatever it is- and how can we ensure that changing the players changes the game -at least for a couple of terms?
The bureaucracy, could all but take care of itself in the year 2013, as well over 50% of current staff qualifies for a full pension I believe. Of course they have to opt to take it …. guessing many will…. why not. Get paid to REALLY do nothing. And given the precedent our current council has established, each should be entitled to a Berry style handshake.
Before I would be prepared to follow anyone through the ‘portal’ I would really need to see their game plan first.
On the subject of ‘portals’, before following the leader here, make damn sure it isn’t the portal Alice took!
That’s the portal we took to get in. We are now looking for the portal to get out!
If the new economic commision ends up having the same board as does the current then we are in trouble. Focus needs to be less on tourism and more on creating well paying jobs and supporting local business. Nanaimo has some amasing attractions for the person living here and while they may bring tourism to a small extent promoting them for potential and current residents is to me the way to go. The LED Sign has potential but what about a luge track from the top of Mt. Benson, just got to make sure folk sign a disclaimer.
Despite over 50% of staff reaching full retirement by 2013 I believe we still need an arms length core review. With the above would certainly remove more of the chafe from the wheat and could identify significant tax savings.
That and uping community contribution amounts from development should create a fair nest egg to replace that lost with the borrowing for the Convention Centre.
Re food production, this is a new definition in the proposed Zoning Bylaw: URBAN FOOD GARDEN – means the use of land on a limited scale for the growing, harvesting and wholesaling of fruits, vegetables, edible plants and the like but specifically excludes the growing of mushrooms. Has potential but unfortunately not for the mushrooms to make the portal a reality.
The luge track down Mount Benson: better check with NALT before you start planning that. We could end up with David Suzuki, just days past his seventy-fifth birthday, camped out at the top of a tree on Mount Benson, along with his buddies. Do we want that?
With fifty percent of city hall staff reaching pension eligibility before or during 2013, let’s try what the local school board has done at least once, although years ago: a “buy-out” of a similar group approaching retirement. One-time pain for long-term gain? Might be something to consider. Might not even require a core review to prompt some city hall employees to pick up a buy-out package and scurry happily into earlier retirement.
I have serious misgivings about this proposed zoning bylaw on urban food gardens, based on nearly twenty years of almost living off a huge garden, hunting, and fishing while living on agricultural acreage which was regional district, not city, but completely surrounded by the city after its expansion. Too many details for any one here to be interested, but very specific. I’m concerned that people who simply don’t know enough about the administrivia (at the city government level) and the skill required (at the actual “doing it” level) to do that will be the ones making the decisions, and a great many mistakes may be made by both groups.
Are you kidding about the cultivation of mushrooms being specifically prohibited? That’s going to come as a shock to a friend who’s been raising mushrooms (“non-portal” type) in his home for years. Mushroom raising kits are readily available from most companies who publish catalogues. If this *is* true–why?
I am, frankly, tired of this current trend about grow it yourself, less (or no) dependence on off-Island food sources. The words “bunch of rookies” come to mind.
With developers deliberately shrinking themselves (eg, InSight’s announcement that it’s ceasing construction of the highrise condo on Front Street), I really wonder if there’s any point in looking to “community contribution amounts from development” to rebuild the lost nest egg. If no development, or limited development happens, that’s not an area to look to for revenue.
I have to wonder what we have come to when we actually debate the legality of someone growing a garden on their land, whether it is for their own use or for exchange of goods or money. Barring practices more noxious than burning wet wood and waste in a fireplace or more noisy at night than running a lawnmower or grass blower, what business is it in a free society for some to decide whether someone else can have a garden or to determine what they can do with the produce of same?
It seems that this is one of those times when we really need to put our brains in gear before we open our mouths. No disrespect intended for Wendy, or Lantzville Council, or Nanaimo newspapers. I wasted some intellectual capital on it myself before I stopped short to ask myself what I had been smoking. What have we come to???
On the subject of Urban Food Garden, would that include some of Nanaimo’s more infamous HERBS?? Talk about tourist attraction!!
BC Bud had Budweiser beat on so many levels!! :^)
Forgive me if I repeat myself, I know I suggested this on my blog but with regards this EDC and the proposed budget.
It makes more sense to me, to find this boy or girl wonder from whom the sun emanates, and then leave the budgeting to them. Saying we expect you to single handedly secure Nanaimo’s fortunes, and here’s half a million to do it with….. is just short sighted. Funny, this council has been doing so well on so many other levels, it’s not like them to drop the ball on important issues.
Ron:
You would have no problem then, if a dump truck full of nice good old cow manure mixed with rotting fish heads were dropped off next door so your neighbor could build up their soil?
You would not be concerned about the gallons of fertilizer finding it’s way into the ground water, as farmers seek to improve their productivity?
I too, don’t oppose the Victory Garden, have grown many myself, but starting to cultivate large areas as a commercial endeavor, could prove to be one of those can ‘o worms.
Jim:
My neighbour can do all those things now, can’t he/she? And if he/she can’t, then the same regulations would apply for any residential property. Why does growing food for exchange somehow affect the rights of owners on their property.
PS: In just a few days we will be rid of cosmetic pesticides on ALL properties.
Ron; If your neighbour does all those things now, you need new neighbours. I doubt they could without running ‘Afoul’ of some local bylaw. Years ago, my wife raised Angora rabbits in the city, when it was still legal. The ‘leavings’ of her critters (less than 10) were put in a compost heap and kept covered. We still had a visit from the bylaw officer because some neighbours were senstive to the perfume coming their way.
Would you apply the same logic to raising chickens, ducks, geese, rabbits etc. on the same ‘food producing’ city lot?
Jim: My neighbours do not do such things: but they could…
You make my point here. It is not the agriculture which is the problem, but the smell, the noise, etc. for which bylaws do exist. Therefore lets concentrate on the problems, not on some general theory. All these problems do, in the end, come down to us.
And actually I can apply the same logic to raising chickens as this is now permitted by bylaw.
Finding no “Reply” red response opportunity to reply directly, I am copying and pasting Ron Bolin’s response to my comments above, with my response following.
Ron Bolin: “I have to wonder what we have come to when we actually debate the legality of someone growing a garden on their land, whether it is for their own use or for exchange of goods or money. Barring practices more noxious than burning wet wood and waste in a fireplace or more noisy at night than running a lawnmower or grass blower, what business is it in a free society for some to decide whether someone else can have a garden or to determine what they can do with the produce of same? It seems that this is one of those times when we really need to put our brains in gear before we open our mouths. No disrespect intended for Wendy, or Lantzville Council, or Nanaimo newspapers. I wasted some intellectual capital on it myself before I stopped short to ask myself what I had been smoking. What have we come to???”
Wendy Smith: Some of the details which I previously classified as boring I will now point out, highlights only, because otherwise too lengthy, but beginning with asides:
There will come a time when noxious fumes from neighbours burning wet wood in fireplaces will not be a problem, since I expect that at some point woodburning *fireplaces* will not be permitted within the city. The city (or some other organization) has already, I believe, run a program subsidizing replacement of old inefficient woodburners with updated models in homes where they are being used as the main heat source, so I think that’s an indication of things to come. Homeowner insurance policies may have changed, but when I owned a home with two woodburning fireplaces there was a proviso that if a fire occurred as a result of a chimney fire which spread, the policy was null and void, no coverage, unless I could prove that both chimneys were swept once a year. Burning wet wood causes more build-up in the chimney than dry wood, or so I’ve been told. Ron Bolin said: “It seems that this is one of those times when we really need to put our brains in gear before we open our mouths. No disrespect intended for Wendy . . . ” If no disrespect was intended, what *was* intended? Ron Bolin mentions, in response to Jim Taylor, that pesticides will soon be a thing of the past. There is a difference between pesticides and fertilizers. A gardener would, or should, know that. Jim Taylor also asks how Ron Bolin would feel if rotting fish heads were used to build up soil. A neighbour did that to me thirty years ago, and since both houses were close to the property lines, I suffered. Not only the smell, but also that my dog (in rural areas dogs *do* wander, unless they’re seen to be chasing stock, like cattle, in which case they’re immediately shot, usually by their owners), attracted to this mess, went over, ate some, came home, and vomited down a forced-air heat vent/duct an hour before I was expecting guests for a stay of several days.
Many participants here are now paying for water useage, I believe, and intensive cultivation requires water, and is a concern when we are having our attention brought to water shortages, although whether that would be applicable on the Island is debatable. People may have to pay for water useage, but the water is, at least, there, I believe. That pushes an urban gardener to water-conserving and weed-discouraging mulch between the rows of vegetables. Both natural mulches, such as wood chips, or synthetic mulches (which are petroleum product based, another debatable area) are attractors for insects, sometimes harmful to plants.
We are facing the pressure of the increasing urban/wilderness interface and its resulting problems (deer, black bears) and urban gardening is an attractor for both deer and black bears. I have had fruit trees on which deer have leaf-feasted and, remarkably, have taken the major part of each leaf, leaving behind only the central stem. *Any* piece of fruit which has fallen from a tree must be picked up and removed as soon as possible, or there’s a problem with bears and raccoons. Once opened my garden door and almost walked into a black bear, invited in by plums which had dropped unnoticed. There was nothing I could do about raccoons, who had a freeway from a bluff to my fruit trees, since they travelled from treetop to treetop until they reached my trees. I can attest to the fact that a six-foot wire fence will not deter deer. They can clear them with no problem. If people were to use fish offal to build soil, that’s another invitation to black bears.
This is an area with a great deal of rain. Will rookie urban intensive gardeners know that there’s a reason why the Chinese and others have terraced their mountainsides to avoid slippage? If someone tears out a steeply-sloped front lawn and then plants vegetables, will they understand that if they run the lines of vegetables straight down the slope, it’s possible they could end up with half their garden across the street? Will they know to terrace or to go to “square foot” gardening, where the soil is contained by large boards?
We have a relatively short growing period, although certainly longer than most places in Canada. But some seem to believe that they can grow enough on an average city-sized lot to sustain themselves year-round. Not unless they have an acre or more, they’re not. That leads into food preservation, which I’m not going to detail. But a considerable issue with sometimes fatal results if done incorrectly.
I’ve finished, and obviously with my brain idling in neutral. Back into gear and gone.
Wendy.I know people that produce just about enough vegetables & fruit on a 20ft x 20ft garden to last all year.
One of those has enough left over to take to the farmers market.
Urban farming can help with our food supply & often it is organically grown which makes it an even better product than many supermarket purchases
It’s a lifestyle choice than should not be overlooked.
Some gardeners plant winter crops lengthening the growing season even more.
Throughout the world urban farming is the norm.
Here it is being derided possibly because it does not fit the neatly pressed neighbourhoods that the real estate industry & developers advertise as the new norm!
The old town of Nanaimo is covered with smaller homes that once had productive gardens to supplement store bought foods; it can happen again.
This is not about home gardening.
It is most certainly not about a LED sign on Mount Benson: what “responsible, sane”, conservation-minded civic-minded blogger would come up with that?
It is not about yet another group of know-nothing old farts, gossiping over coffee about economic development, pretending to know all about economic development.
It is not about another group of know-nothing imported “experts”, talking the talk but not walking the walk making like the biggest civic financial boondoggle of twentieth century is of any use: @ 800K+/annum it isn’t: suck it up!
It is not about, every body’s doin’ it, boilerplate solutions: a C$30M+/- cruise ship terminal awaiting a throng of passengers that may, or may not, come and certainly will not come with bulging pockets.
Instead it recognizes that consumer binge is over, that the only source of our wealth creation, sitting on our butts watching our home prices inflate, is not and never was.
It is about reviving Nanaimo’s moribund economy: encouraging an indigenous industry to get people off the streets and welfare, keeping our people at home, gainfully employed.
It is about the thousands upon thousands of acres of land lying fallow waiting the next burst of sprawl that will never come.
It is about eventually turning Woodgrove parking lot into value added!
It is about real farming, food production, machinery processing, packaging and marketing.
It is about overcoming our resentment toward locals who recognize the need for change, sticking their professional necks out, speaking up, working sincerely towards implementing new ideas that apparently threaten the status quo.
It is about clearing out the non-elected chaff at city hall. It is about electing responsible people with vision and courage.
It is about being ahead of the curve.
PS . . .
Because, of necessity, food processing is the future . . .
Roger:
“It is most certainly not about a LED sign on Mount Benson: what “responsible, sane”, conservation-minded civic-minded blogger would come up with that?”
I presume you are a very serious minded individual who does not recognize tongue in cheek humor?
If Nanaimo wants to ‘grow’ some keep them at home, well paying industrial type businesses, then those wishing to do this, need to do more than pay lip service to the notion.
I have yet to hear how Nanaimo is going to attract these type of businesses to our fair city? What type of business proposal would you have to make to draw a business away from the hundreds and thousands of other communities seeking to do the same.? Do we offer ease of transport to bring in raw material and export the finished product economically? Do we have a pool, of eager, hardworking people renown the world over for their non-radical union behavior? Are we known as a place where labour disruptions are unlikely? Are we known as the province where the possibility of an NDP government coming in at any election, complete with the appearance of pro labour anti business? As a labour pool do we have a world wide reputation for high productivity and low wages??
As a nation we can’t even make clothes and shoes anymore and even our auto industry all but evaporated a few years back, so what industrial base is proposed as the saviour of Nanaimo??
I think we might be wise to recognize what we excel at, and what makes Nanaimo, Nanaimo and quit pretending we could ever be some central island industrial centre.
Nanaimo could become the retirement centre for the Island and our growth industry should be healtcare and building more storage units for the tsunami of dementia patients that are waiting in the wings.
That is where Nanaimo’s real future lies. The days of thousands working in forestry and the fishery making great money, are a thing of the past.
Attracting retirees, with their bags of money, and then being able to care for them as they are embraced by dementia are likely the growth industries that will continue to provide city hall with sufficient funds to keep the bureaucracy rolling for years and years to come.
As for a viable agriculture industry, that will only work if we run shuttle buses to Mexico, as you aren’t going to find any ‘locals’ that want to work in that business. Few people are willing to pay the price for $25 / hr. bean pickers.
As for the prospects of finding someone who can REALLY run the EDC, this bunch thinks a salary in the $100 – $150 thousand range is going to find such a person. What they will get is yet another grad from business school with nothing but learned theory to bring to the table, which will most likely baffle those on council and fit right in with the current lot at city hall.
The last two senior management positions were filled by promoting from within the existing beaurocracy,because after “extensive search”,the most qualified candidate(s)just happened to already be employed at the city.Jeez we must have one helluva staff,which would certainly suggest they will find the new economic development genius right under their noses.
All of the comments on this topic can be distilled down to Roger’s wisdom when he says “It is about clearing out the non-elected chaff at city hall.It is about electing responsible people with vision and courage.” What is so difficult about understanding that? (But don’t ask me how to do it,although I would think it should begin by getting rid of the Mayor John ‘it’s so difficult’ Ruttan).